Journal DDio's 120U

[DDio]

I'm sure you've pulled your municipalities water report to see what's in the tap. Most people consider it as stable month-to-month. I think JBL, Salifert and Hanna provide test kits to get you some idea of the Ca and Mg in your water. I used to use the Hanna Alkalinity Colorimeter to get an understanding.

My town which borders Chicago has a water quality report that really only reports on harmful substances like lead, nitrates, etc.

Since Chicago supplies our water, I took a look there and it looks like for Calcium there's 34 mg/l and for magnesium it's about 12 mg/l. Total alkalinity (CaCO3) is about 110 mg/l. These are the averages because it looks like they took samples from either different locations, or just different dates.

Having never used Ca and Mg for top of water, what should the ideal numbers be? My only basis for these parameters has been reef keeping, but only from the extent that I'd use a high quality salt mix, my calcium reactor would take care of Ca, and I'd dose mg as needed, along with kalk to stabilize PH since the calcium reactor would effect it.

I'll need to check those kits out, but the Salifert Ca and Mg didn't have freshwater kits when I checked recently.

I still have my hanna checkers, but they're marine versions.

Also I forgot to add this to my previous post, but the needle on my CO2 regulator finally moved. I'd suspect that within the next couple days I'll need to swap out the tank. So out of this 10lbs tank I was able to get 6 months worth of CO2 injection.

 

[Art]

That's about the length of time I would get out of a 10 lb tank.

As for the Saliferts, I believe that magnesium (and I think calcium) can be used with both salt and freshwater. The Hanna's are specific for the type of water so you need the Hanna freshwater ones.

While local water reports are handy, I've learned not to trust them. I'm sure they use much more accurate test kits than I, but the variances I've seen plus the chlorine/chloramine spikes I've experienced, are heard to deal with.

 

[DDio]

That's about the length of time I would get out of a 10 lb tank.

As for the Saliferts, I believe that magnesium (and I think calcium) can be used with both salt and freshwater. The Hanna's are specific for the type of water so you need the Hanna freshwater ones.

While local water reports are handy, I've learned not to trust them. I'm sure they use much more accurate test kits than I, but the variances I've seen plus the chlorine/chloramine spikes I've experienced, are heard to deal with.

I definitely don't trust the water reports. They're self reported by Chicago municipal water employees, which is like police departments that conduct their own internal investigations on police misconduct lol.

I'll need to do a little research on the Salifert tests. I could have sworn that both MG and CA were reef only, but I didn't really dig into it much further than seeing if they'd be able to also be used for freshwater. I'd definitely be interested in the Hanna checkers. They've always made the process so much easier without needing to differentiate between colors that almost look exactly the same.

 

[DDio]

So I just checked the instruction manuals from Salifert and Calcium is able to be used in freshwater but Magnesium is "marine only".

I'll need to find an alternate Mg test kit and I think Hanna does make a freshwater checker for it but I'll need to look into that a bit later.

ETA: rather than updating with another new post I figured I'd just edit this one with an update I didn't think to share.

Yesterday a fellow planted tank enthusiast who has sent me cuttings of some more rare plants sent me another package. He was breaking down an emersed setup and didn't have a place for some of the plants. He sent me a massive amount of Buce Titan, Buce Phantom, and a good amount of crypt parva. I added them to the tank last night after giving them a good rinse and I have to admit that it was tough to find spots for them because of how many there were.

Took some pics of where I placed them. I intend on redoing my nano so I selected spots where I can easily remove them for use in my nano.

I'll come back and update this post with pics. But I added half of the titan to the right side, tucked in between some dragon stone. The other half went in a nice location on my spider wood on the left side, and the phantom on the same spider wood, but in a spot above/behind the titan. I'll also include an FTS. The glass is a bit dirty since I haven't cleaned it in about a week, well the outside is dirty.








The one thing that's bothering me are the blyxa right of center. I can't really explain it, but they just don't "fit" where they're at.

 

[GreggZ]

So I just checked the instruction manuals from Salifert and Calcium is able to be used in freshwater but Magnesium is "marine only".

I'll need to find an alternate Mg test kit and I think Hanna does make a freshwater checker for it but I'll need to look into that a bit later.

If you know your dKH and Ca you can calculate for Mg. It's a close enough method for our purposes.

((17.86 x dGH) - (2.5 x Ca ppm)) / 4.1 = Mg ppm

 

[DDio]

If you know your dKH and Ca you can calculate for Mg. It's a close enough method for our purposes.

((17.86 x dGH) - (2.5 x Ca ppm)) / 4.1 = Mg ppm

Perfect, that will save me about $70 lol. Honestly close enough is all I really need. I'm just worried that not knowing what my Mg levels are, perhaps I'm not noticing a problem that I can easily solve by adding Mg.

 

[Immortal1]

I'm sure you've pulled your municipalities water report to see what's in the tap. Most people consider it as stable month-to-month. I think JBL, Salifert and Hanna provide test kits to get you some idea of the Ca and Mg in your water. I used to use the Hanna Alkalinity Colorimeter to get an understanding.

Interesting side note regarding municipalities water being stable month to month...
If you live along the Mississippi River and the municipality uses the river as a water source the type? of water you get varies to some degree throughout the year. Learned this before finally switching to RO. In the spring when the river floods from snow melt up North, the level of Ca and Mg (along with TDS ) drops a lot! Like almost in half depending on how much flooding you get.

Now with @DDio living in Chicago, I am guessing his water source would be Lake Michigan. That water source should, in theory, be much more stable.

Would be curious how stable well water is.

 

[Immortal1]

Perfect, that will save me about $70 lol. Honestly close enough is all I really need. I'm just worried that not knowing what my Mg levels are, perhaps I'm not noticing a problem that I can easily solve by adding Mg.

Was going to reply with basically the same answer. Now that I use RO, I have not needed to test Mg levels. But when I was using tap water I did test Ca, dKH and Mg regularly.

 

[DDio]

Interesting side note regarding municipalities water being stable month to month...
If you live along the Mississippi River and the municipality uses the river as a water source the type? of water you get varies to some degree throughout the year. Learned this before finally switching to RO. In the spring when the river floods from snow melt up North, the level of Ca and Mg (along with TDS) drops a lot! Like almost in half depending on how much flooding you get.

Now with @DDio living in Chicago, I am guessing his water source would be Lake Michigan. That water source should, in theory, be much more stable.

Would be curious how stable well water is.

The lake is very stable, but the one variable is whatever the water picks up as it winds its way through hundreds of thousands of miles of pipe under the city.

Typically this time of year there are a bunch of water main breaks that disrupts sediment in the pipes. What's interesting is they never bother telling residents to either boil or let their water run after a repair. The town I lived in prior to moving to my current town, along with the current town I'm in actually calls and tells you that the water will be off for a time range, and then to allow the water to run once it's back on, or even issue a boil order. Chicago just shrugs their shoulders and lets people drink and bathe in contaminated water lol.

Surprisingly the TDS is actually low for city water. I remember when I initially set up this tank and my nano, I did a TDS check and it was around 110-112. GH of 9 and KH of 6 and a PH of 7.4

 

[GreggZ]

Would be curious how stable well water is.

It's not. Same situation with the river. The dGH and dKH of my well water varies quite a bit throughout the year.

Hence why I only use RO water.

 

[DDio]

Quick update.

Plants are doing good, fish are doing good, and the CO2 is somehow still working lol. The needle has dropped quite a bit so I imagine it'll be any day now when I need to swap it out.

 

[JPog]

Glad to hear the plants are doing well. i think once you really get the stem mass going in the back, things will be very stable. You mentioned the Blyxa. I think if you even it out more between the two halves you might be better with it. Looks really happy in there.

 

[DDio]

I realized I haven't updated this in a few days but this is what I did since the last update:

I was burned out last week so when Friday rolled around, after work I had company over so I didn't get to do the water change. I waited until Saturday and got it done. I also did full maintenance on the Oase. I do have to say that if you clean the pre filter at a minimum, weekly, even if you wait 2 months, the inside of the canister is perfectly clean. I'm going to push maintenance out from 2 to 3 months on this one.

Plants seem to be growing in nicely. I am still seeing that long filamentous algae here and there, but remove it as soon as I see it.

The stems are mostly recovered. I'm getting close to having enough new trimmings to finally discard the old beat up stems. When I have enough fresh new growth, I'll probably take the opportunity to move both Rotala onto the right side and then move the Ludwigia Arcuata and Limnophila over the the left side since the leaf shapes are more interesting.

I'll get a fresh FTS and post it tomorrow. I'll also hunt around and see if I can get a pic of the algae I'm referring to.

My dog was neutered and microchipped yesterday so the poor guy has been miserable. He was high as a kite after I picked him up at 5pm last night and was still flying high around the time he went to sleep. His pupils were so dilated that he looked like an owl lol. He couldn't deal with the cone of shame so I went and picked up an inflatable donut collar for him. He hates that too but at least can navigate without knocking into stuff. Hopefully the incision heals up quick so that I can remove the donut. He's been walking extremely slowly and just has this pathetic look on his face all the time. He did get some meds but it seems they're only taking the edge off. He ate about an hour after coming home and drank a lot of water so in the grand scheme of things he's okay lol. Anyway, this is why I'll get an FTS up tomorrow.

Almost forgot, I did lose one rasbora towards the end of the week last week. I'm kind of wondering if these were older rasbora since he's had them a while and they were close to full grown when I bought them.

I've been wanting to add more fish, specifically a dozen cardinal tetras and a dozen panda corydoras but am focused on getting the plants into shape first.

I did notice that the GSA stopped appearing on the glass when I dosed all the macros after my water change. It seemed that that GSA began appearing on the glass and would spread for 3-4 days after a water change and then suddenly stop when there was enough PO4 in the water column. It was limited to appearing on the glass only so I'm glad that front loading the macros solved that problem. I plan to continue doing this going forward. I'll probably test on Friday before the water change to see where everything is at.

Somehow that CO2 tank is still not empty . I mean, it's gotta be empty before the end of the week lol.

 

[JPog]

I was burned out last week so when Friday rolled around, after work I had company over so I didn't get to do the water change. I waited until Saturday and got it done. I also did full maintenance on the Oase. I do have to say that if you clean the pre filter at a minimum, weekly, even if you wait 2 months, the inside of the canister is perfectly clean. I'm going to push maintenance out from 2 to 3 months on this one.

That's your problem right there, putting socializing over water changes. Are you all in or not .

 

[DDio]

That's your problem right there, putting socializing over water changes. Are you all in or not .

Unfortunately it was family that invited themselves over lol.

 

[Art]

Poor dog! Would any of us be doing any better than he is??

My recommendation is to hold out on the fish until you get the plants healthy. Better for the plants, the fish and you!

 

[DDio]

Poor dog! Would any of us be doing any better than he is??

My recommendation is to hold out on the fish until you get the plants healthy. Better for the plants, the fish and you!

I've seen friends after they had vasectomies and it didn't seem like a pleasant experience lol. From what I understand there are some vets that can do a similar procedure for dogs so that they don't lose their jingle bells, but it's not cheap and also not foolproof. He does look miserable though. I think most of his misery is from the donut he's wearing. I ordered a surgical suit so hopefully that will help more so that forcing him to wear a donut lol.

Yeah I agree. No sense in adding another variable at this point.

 

[DDio]

Happy New Year everyone!

A couple quick updates:

When I did my water change I was really surprised by the pre filter on the Oase. The filter pads weren't anywhere near as dirty as they normally are. Normally after a week they're pretty dirty, so much so that I can't push maintenance out to two weeks. This time they were so clean that I could have easily let them go another week. I'm wondering if this is a sign that my plant health is improving seeing as I never overfeed the fish and much of the waste trapped had to have been from decaying plant matter.

Anyhow aside from that, believe it or not the CO2 tank is still chugging along lol. I have no idea how it's still working. It can't possibly make it to the weekend. I say that, but I've been saying that for two weeks now

I'm still seeing that very long thread algae that almost looks like a hair. I won't see it one day, then the next there it is tangled up in one of my plants.

One last thing I forgot to mention last week is that one of my buce flowered! One of the others has a flower spike popping up so that one should flower in a week or two as well.

I'll get an FTS up tonight after the lights come on.

Next step for this tank is to remove all the Rotala, take cuttings of the healthy growth, and move them all to the back right corner while removing the Limnophila and the Arcuata and move those to where the Rotala were. In front of the Limnophila I'll place a few of the crypt spiralis red since they've overgrown the spot they're currently in and needing thinning out. That should give a nice contrast of colors and leaf shapes.

 

[JPog]

Happy New Year!

Sounds like the cleaner filter can be a result of more uptake less unhealthy leaves decaying. Obviously if you increased water changes that would help too, that's another reason why bigger water changes are better since the result would be less organics in the filter which means you could probably go longer between changes, which from the results of the maintenance thread would be a nice thing.

Personally (I might get some flack from this) but I think filters are over-rated. I don't think there is anything magical going on in there, not any different from what's already taking place in the tank. Once organics are in there, they stay part of the system until they are removed, so to me plant uptake, water changes, removing decaying leaves are more important and have a bigger impact on water quality. The filter once established is to me primarily a flow device in most tanks as the bulk of the filtration is coming from other means.

Even with the biggest filters it seems like one would still have algae if using strong lights and not even plants and/or water changes and other organic removal means, which tells me the bio-media in the filter is not that effective.

 

[DDio]

Happy New Year!

Sounds like the cleaner filter can be a result of more uptake less unhealthy leaves decaying. Obviously if you increased water changes that would help too, that's another reason why bigger water changes are better since the result would be less organics in the filter which means you could probably go longer between changes, which from the results of the maintenance thread would be a nice thing.

Personally (I might get some flack from this) but I think filters are over-rated. I don't think there is anything magical going on in there, not any different from what's already taking place in the tank. Once organics are in there, they stay part of the system until they are removed, so to me plant uptake, water changes, removing decaying leaves are more important and have a bigger impact on water quality. The filter once established is to me primarily a flow device in most tanks as the bulk of the filtration is coming from other means.

Even with the biggest filters it seems like one would still have algae if using strong lights and not even plants and/or water changes and other organic removal means, which tells me the bio-media in the filter is not that effective.

I'm probably doing somewhere near 80% weekly and have been for a while, but I agree that it must be fewer decaying leaves. Whenever I feed the fish, they're eating everything I put in there within a couple minutes and I'm feeding them about once every other day. Some weeks I might forget and go an extra day between feedings.

I really regret not getting a drilled tank. It would have made things drastically easier on me, including from a maintenance perspective, and likely less expensive. I've gotten lazier over the years so I misjudged myself in how motivated I'd actually be to tear down a tank of this size and set it up as a reef tank lol. It would be a lot of work, and I'm not sure I'd have the motivation to actually do it.