20+ year Reefkeeper turning to freshwater. Would like some feedback.

[JCole]

Hey everyone,

I'm Josh (JCole on most of the reef forums). I've been in the saltwater side of the hobby for over 20 years, mostly running Acropora-dominant systems. I'm officially getting out of reef keeping and converting my current tank to a planted freshwater tank. I'll be honest up front: I know almost nothing about planted tanks. So I figured the best move was to introduce myself, start a build thread, and beg for help LOL.

A little background so you know a bit about my previous addiction!

For a long stretch, my main tank was a 150-gallon Acro tank plumbed to a sump, a 20-gallon chaeto refugium, and a frag tank out in the garage. I crashed it in late 2020, lost over 70 Acros, and kept about six. Rebuilt it and kept going.












I eventually outgrew the 150 with coral colonies and needed to upgrade. My next tank was a 480-gallon acrylic peninsula, 8'x4'x2', with a 300-gallon stock tank sump in the garage.







The aquarium was a dream aquarium of mine, but with having a full time job running a company with 3 boys in travel ball baseball, it consumed all of my time and I just could not give the tank what it actually needed and deserved. I eventually reset it, built my own cement rock and shelves, and sold the whole system in early 2025.





After that, I downsized to a Marineland 180 (72x24x24) in the same room. This is the tank I'm converting to freshwater.



WHERE I'M AT RIGHT NOW

• Tank: Marineland 180, 72x24x24, glass.
• Goal: High-tech planted. CO2, good light, fertilizers, the whole thing.
• Cleaning: Done. I stripped the tank and sump with bleach and muriatic acid to get all the coralline algae off. It's clean and ready for water.
• Sump: My Trigger Triton 44 sump is already set up and staying. I'm not going canister right now.
• Controller: I've run an Apex for about 8 years, and I also wrote my own Raspberry Pi controller app that talks to the Apex and my Kasa, Shelly, and Jebao gear.
• Lights: I pulled the halides and kept the pendants. For now, each pendant has a 120V LED grow light bulb in it.
• Substrate: I have 19 bags of CaribSea Eco-Complete Planted ready to go.

WHERE I NEED HELP AND FEEDBACK

1. CO2 with a sump: I know a sump gasses off CO2. Since I'm keeping mine, what tips do you have to keep the loss down (lower the return, cover the sump, change the overflow, anything else)?
2. CO2 control: I can run a solenoid and a pH probe off the Apex or my own app. Do you control CO2 by pH, by a timer, or both? Is a drop checker still the thing to trust? And what do you use to actually get the CO2 into 180 gallons—an inline reactor on the return or diffusers? What safeguards do you run so a stuck solenoid doesn't gas the fish overnight?
3. Lighting: Are LED grow bulbs in the pendants enough for a high-tech 72" long, 24" deep tank, or is that a stopgap? If I upgrade, what would you put over it?
4. Substrate and hardscape: I read that people put lava rock in filter bags on the bottom to build up hills and slopes so the deep rooting plants get more depth. Is that the way to do it, and how deep should the Eco-Complete be on top? Is 19 bags enough for what I'm trying to do?
5. Fertilizers: EI or lean dosing for a first-timer? I'm used to dosing two-part and testing a lot, so numbers do not scare me.
6. Plants and fish: I want to start with beginner plants, but I'm not scared to try the harder stuff. Acros taught me patience, so I'd like to work up to the more advanced plants. What would you start with in a 72" high-tech tank, and what would you add later? And what fish do well in that setup?
7. Water: I've always run RODI for the reef. For planted, do I use straight tap, RO with remineralizer, or a blend? Which GH and KH numbers should I be shooting for?
8. Cycling: Plants change how you cycle, right? What's the order of operations?

Fair warning, I'm a gear nerd and I tend to wing it, so feel free to tell me when I'm about to do something dumb. I'll keep this thread updated as I go.

Any help or guidance would be appreciated.

Thank you!!!

Will be continued!

 

[Unexpected]

Welcome!

Are you dead set on Eco Complete? I found it terrible to work with because it breaks stems when trying to plant. My advice is to return it and literally go with anything else. Black Diamond Blasting sand is a good alternative.

Sump: just cover where you can, yes you'll loose more CO2, but CO2 is cheap.

CO2 control: the Apex will work great. You can use it to control levels and as the timer. I use a CoralVue to run the timing and to monitor as a backup. But running a Yugang reactor in the sump area is the way to go and just have the Apex monitor pH and cut the CO2 as a failsafe.

Fertilizer: EI with an inert substrate like Eco complete is a must IMO. You can run lean with aqua soils, but once the soil depletes, you'll need to increase to near EI or change the soil out or replenish in areas.

Plants: luckily, 90% of our plants are beginner friendly. Get the CO2, light and ferts right and even difficult plants are easy. Many just refuse to take the time and learn. Your reefing has probably already taught you how to easily achieve the parameters.

Fish: stick with soft water South American fish. 100s to choose from. Neutral water fish will work also. Rainbows and the like will do just fine in low pH water. Just avoid African Ciclids and such.

Water: stick with RO, but your tap could work also. Shoot for a GH around 6 or 7 degrees. Ca no more than 40ppm and Mg no more than 10ppm. Higher isn't a problem, just unnecessary. Lower is fine, but between 30 to 40ppm Ca and 5 to 10ppm Mg is where many run their tanks. If you ask Facebook, KH is a must, but most of us run zero or have some because their tap water has it. Most of the available plants grow better in 0dKH. Just never believe 0dKH is a problem. I assure you it's not.

Cycling: plant from day one. Let the plants cycle the tank. Let the ugly normal phase happen while trying to get the plants looking nice. It'll take some months for the bacteria to establish a diverse community. Just grow the plants while they do their thing. No need to test. The only kits I'd recommend are GH and KH (if using Tap) but pulling your local water report can tell you average Ca:Mg. I do recommend a good gram scale for measuring.

Note on fertilizer: make your own, adjust the weights for your needs and it's pennies on the dollar compared to commercial products. Those of us making our own can get you sorted. Marcos are the easiest. Micros are a bit more work, but it's really just sourcing the elements. @Burr740 sells his micros at a competitive price. Has dry salts to mix your own or premade packets to mix in RO water. He's one of the best and a judge for the AGA. Can't go wrong with his product.

Hope this helps and tag me when you start your journal.

 

[NC AL]

Fellow reefer dabbling in the freshwater side. Newer to planted tanks so no advice to give.

 

[Rob23]

Welcome to the forum. @Unexpected has given good advice. Really looking forward to seeing where you take this tank.

 

[Koan]

Plants

Buy healthy , buy large Quantities of very healthy plant mass are your friend. You really want to pack it in there when you're launching a new tank

To whatever extent you can you can buy already immersed form rather than emersed form that then has to convert, so much the better, our own @Burr740's plant list is here. Member @fablau periodically has large plant batch sales as well, both here and on eBay

free to tell me when I'm about to do something dumb

Plenty of holes to put your foot in when you're getting started you know how that goes. @Dennis Wong's 2-hour Aquarist is the best online library to get your nerd on

For instance..

Which GH and KH numbers should I be shooting for?

Aquarium Water Parameters: pH, KH, GH & TDS

Aquarium water parameters explained: what pH, KH, GH and TDS actually do for plants and livestock, and which are worth adjusting. Start with what matters.

www.2hraquarist.com

Cycling: Plants change how you cycle, right? What's the order of operations?

Should You Cycle a Planted Tank Before Planting? The Dark Start Method

Cycling matters for plants, not just fish. A tank that builds biological maturity before planting resists the diatoms, green dust algae, and plant melt that hit fresh setups hardest. See why maturity comes first, and how an aquasoil dark start gets you there faster.

www.2hraquarist.com

Ask all the questions you like!

 

[JayP]

As you can already see, you picked the right place to come and get advice. Lot's of sharp folks here including a few "pros". Welcome to the fresh side.

 

[artandsoul]

Are you dead set on Eco Complete? I found it terrible to work with because it breaks stems when trying to plant. My advice is to return it and literally go with anything else. Black Diamond Blasting sand is a good alternative.

Your thinking of the old eco complete, the new eco planted is same size as stratum with some bigger pieces in it. So it holds plants better than stratum for sure.
pic added of the new eco and stratum

I would Def use the eco planted you already have it. I used it for long time even have some that's almost 20 years old so it will last forever unlike stratum its kinda a ripoff . But does go on sale at PetSmart so its around the same price of eco. WHen I got into planted tanks eco was the stratum of its time lol.

The black diamond medium sand is nice looking stuff after u rinse it forever, Looks great and is very very cheap using some in a shrimp tank build.

 

[artandsoul]

I will say If u can return the eco and want to save 500.00 go get the blk diamond sand its 14.00 for 50lb bag, around 45lb after rinsing, it looks more reef like and is glitter shimmery looking. Not my pics stole them from search.

 

[Unexpected]

Your thinking of the old eco complete, the new eco planted is same size as stratum with some bigger pieces in it. So it holds plants better than stratum for sure.
pic added of the new eco and stratum

I would Def use the eco planted you already have it. I used it for long time even have some that's almost 20 years old so it will last forever unlike stratum its kinda a ripoff . But does go on sale at PetSmart so its around the same price of eco. WHen I got into planted tanks eco was the stratum of its time lol.

The black diamond medium sand is nice looking stuff after u rinse it forever, Looks great and is very very cheap using some in a shrimp tank build.

View attachment 21580

That dark black at the bottom is what I had. Complete trash. Broke more stems than plants I've killed.

 

[CincyScaper]

Lot of great advice here already. I know nothing about the salt water side, but in planted tanks there are few paths that you can take when you consider substrate and fertilizer. There is no one right solution but just different journeys. As @Koan mentioned, the 2 hr aquarist is a great resource to learn in detail about different approaches. Happy scaping.

 

[JCole]

Welcome!

Are you dead set on Eco Complete? I found it terrible to work with because it breaks stems when trying to plant. My advice is to return it and literally go with anything else. Black Diamond Blasting sand is a good alternative.

Sump: just cover where you can, yes you'll loose more CO2, but CO2 is cheap.

CO2 control: the Apex will work great. You can use it to control levels and as the timer. I use a CoralVue to run the timing and to monitor as a backup. But running a Yugang reactor in the sump area is the way to go and just have the Apex monitor pH and cut the CO2 as a failsafe.

Fertilizer: EI with an inert substrate like Eco complete is a must IMO. You can run lean with aqua soils, but once the soil depletes, you'll need to increase to near EI or change the soil out or replenish in areas.

Plants: luckily, 90% of our plants are beginner friendly. Get the CO2, light and ferts right and even difficult plants are easy. Many just refuse to take the time and learn. Your reefing has probably already taught you how to easily achieve the parameters.

Fish: stick with soft water South American fish. 100s to choose from. Neutral water fish will work also. Rainbows and the like will do just fine in low pH water. Just avoid African Ciclids and such.

Water: stick with RO, but your tap could work also. Shoot for a GH around 6 or 7 degrees. Ca no more than 40ppm and Mg no more than 10ppm. Higher isn't a problem, just unnecessary. Lower is fine, but between 30 to 40ppm Ca and 5 to 10ppm Mg is where many run their tanks. If you ask Facebook, KH is a must, but most of us run zero or have some because their tap water has it. Most of the available plants grow better in 0dKH. Just never believe 0dKH is a problem. I assure you it's not.

Cycling: plant from day one. Let the plants cycle the tank. Let the ugly normal phase happen while trying to get the plants looking nice. It'll take some months for the bacteria to establish a diverse community. Just grow the plants while they do their thing. No need to test. The only kits I'd recommend are GH and KH (if using Tap) but pulling your local water report can tell you average Ca:Mg. I do recommend a good gram scale for measuring.

Note on fertilizer: make your own, adjust the weights for your needs and it's pennies on the dollar compared to commercial products. Those of us making our own can get you sorted. Marcos are the easiest. Micros are a bit more work, but it's really just sourcing the elements. @Burr740 sells his micros at a competitive price. Has dry salts to mix your own or premade packets to mix in RO water. He's one of the best and a judge for the AGA. Can't go wrong with his product.

Hope this helps and tag me when you start your journal.

Awesome information! Thank you for all of this!

I already picked up 19 bags of Eco-Complete and 10 bags are already poured in the tank. I heard about this on some podcast, so I figured it would be good. I don't think I will be able to return the 10 bags, so I might just keep them. I wish I had known this sooner, though. Is it impossible to plant with?

Thank you for the fish selection, and that is good to know about the plants. I guess they really can take up the NO3 and NH, huh?

I will definitely look into some DIY fertilizer. Would root tabs work for the time being until CO2 gets introduced? Also, should I start CO2 right away to get my tank acclimated and get used to dialing in the CO2, or should I wait?

Again, thank you!

 

[JCole]

Fellow reefer dabbling in the freshwater side. Newer to planted tanks so no advice to give.

Nice! I see you are in NC. I am in NC as well near Charlotte.

 

[JCole]

Buy healthy , buy large Quantities of very healthy plant mass are your friend. You really want to pack it in there when you're launching a new tank

To whatever extent you can you can buy already immersed form rather than emersed form that then has to convert, so much the better, our own @Burr740's plant list is here. Member @fablau periodically has large plant batch sales as well, both here and on eBay




Plenty of holes to put your foot in when you're getting started you know how that goes. @Dennis Wong's 2-hour Aquarist is the best online library to get your nerd on

For instance..

Aquarium Water Parameters: pH, KH, GH & TDS

Aquarium water parameters explained: what pH, KH, GH and TDS actually do for plants and livestock, and which are worth adjusting. Start with what matters.

www.2hraquarist.com

Should You Cycle a Planted Tank Before Planting? The Dark Start Method

Cycling matters for plants, not just fish. A tank that builds biological maturity before planting resists the diatoms, green dust algae, and plant melt that hit fresh setups hardest. See why maturity comes first, and how an aquasoil dark start gets you there faster.

www.2hraquarist.com

Ask all the questions you like!

Awesome information! Good to know. I will buy large for sure. Thank you! I will definitely reach out for plants soon.

 

[JCole]

As you can already see, you picked the right place to come and get advice. Lot's of sharp folks here including a few "pros". Welcome to the fresh side.

Sure looks like it. Thanks for the warm welcome and information everyone!

 

[JCole]

Your thinking of the old eco complete, the new eco planted is same size as stratum with some bigger pieces in it. So it holds plants better than stratum for sure.
pic added of the new eco and stratum

I would Def use the eco planted you already have it. I used it for long time even have some that's almost 20 years old so it will last forever unlike stratum its kinda a ripoff . But does go on sale at PetSmart so its around the same price of eco. WHen I got into planted tanks eco was the stratum of its time lol.

The black diamond medium sand is nice looking stuff after u rinse it forever, Looks great and is very very cheap using some in a shrimp tank build.

View attachment 21580

Yes, mine is the bottom one. Hope it works as I have 10 bags of it.....

 

[JCole]

I will say If u can return the eco and want to save 500.00 go get the blk diamond sand its 14.00 for 50lb bag, around 45lb after rinsing, it looks more reef like and is glitter shimmery looking. Not my pics stole them from search.

I wont be able to return 9 bags as I already dumped them in. I have 9 other bags I am going to use to finish my scape and fill the refugium. I am crossing my fingers it will work.

 

[JCole]

That dark black at the bottom is what I had. Complete trash. Broke more stems than plants I've killed.

I sure hope not! That would be an expensive lesson.

 

[artandsoul]

I already picked up 19 bags of Eco-Complete and 10 bags are already poured in the tank. I heard about this on some podcast, so I figured it would be good. I don't think I will be able to return the 10 bags, so I might just keep them. I wish I had known this sooner, though. Is it impossible to plant with?

No it works fine! been using it forever period I just got 4 bags to go in my 75g no worrys Really! New eco is way better than the old larger stuff. other member has user error, hate to see people try the pea gravel I have in tanks lmao. We all have opinions I don't like stratum and 99% love it. Been using tweezers in new eco planted works great no issues, I used the hand for 20 years still had no issues on the old bigger fatter eco. There's plenty others to worry about! You can use lava rocks, Lowe's 8.00 bag in mesh bags. laundry bags from dollar tree for height in rear or hills/valleys under the eco.
Def start co2 when I get plants and put co2 on a timer don't need any at night. Most run co2 1-2hours before lights and then turn off co2 30-1 hour before lights go off. Dont want to kill fish but id def do plants for weeks before fish to get cycle over with.
I went cheapo with the niloc g frets on amazon when I got back into tanks everything I need and plants are booming for sure. Just keep researching and you'll get it understood the more the better! like a reef tank it takes time to get it right.

 

[NC AL]

Nice! I see you are in NC. I am in NC as well near Charlotte.

Practically neighbors. I live near exit 65 off of I85.

 

[Unexpected]

Awesome information! Thank you for all of this!

I already picked up 19 bags of Eco-Complete and 10 bags are already poured in the tank. I heard about this on some podcast, so I figured it would be good. I don't think I will be able to return the 10 bags, so I might just keep them. I wish I had known this sooner, though. Is it impossible to plant with?

Thank you for the fish selection, and that is good to know about the plants. I guess they really can take up the NO3 and NH, huh?

I will definitely look into some DIY fertilizer. Would root tabs work for the time being until CO2 gets introduced? Also, should I start CO2 right away to get my tank acclimated and get used to dialing in the CO2, or should I wait?

Again, thank you!

It's not impossible to plant in, just something that drove me nuts. Others are saying it's different now, so hopefully you won't experience that problem.

Root tabs can't cover everything. I personally hate them and an advocate to never use them. That's just me though. Basically, root tabs can't cover everything, unknown levels of each element and can flood the water column with unknowns. The water column will always need to be dosed. Even those using the richest aqua soil still dose the water. Essentially, root feeding is possible with very rich new aqua soil, but only a short time where water column dosing will need to begin. Water column dosing can carry the plants always where no root tabs are needed.

I would start CO2 immediately. It will get you into the fast healthy growing sooner so plant mass will fend off that ugly phase. Plant mass is the best defense against algae. And that plant mass needs to be healthy plant mass.

Yes, once the plants establish, bacterial colony becomes robust, the plants will consume tons of NO3. Some of our plants can grow an inch or more a day.

Don't get too caught up on the Eco Complete, it can be frustrating, but I grew these 2 tanks when I was just learning with Eco.