Journal Frank's Dutch Attempt

[Koan]

Lasted as long as deep fried shrimp at a super bowl party

Maybe some blue crayfish.. they fight back

 

[FrankZ]

Maybe some blue crayfish.. they fight back

I’d eat the crayfish LOL I’m good for a couple pounds of crayfish in one sitting.

 

[Koan]

good for a couple pounds of crayfish

 

[FrankZ]

Some junk floating in the water from playing with the spray bar and bad reflection from the window behind me to the left. Shadow from the spray bar is new

 

[Yugang]

By Thursday morning, there were visible sheets of slime again coming up out of it.

Apologise if it sounds like a broken record, but if I were still not confident with the health and stability of the tank I would throw in some more fast growing plants, or floaters, until everything is settled and you feel less plant mass looks better.

 

[Burr740]

I dont think the slime is clado. You tried algae-fix right? Algae-fix kills clado with a quickness, two days later it'll all be white and dead. Really the only algae Ive ever seen it work on. Its useless for most algae but its freakin lethal to cladophora varieties

It came back on the downoi because a lot of its growth was unhealthy. And the Fern probably had some unhealthy parts too. Even algae like this that can rapidly affect everything tends to originate from unhealthy leaves. Those leaves secrete what it eats or otherwise needs

It sounds counter-intuative because theyre so easy but plants like ferns and anubias are often the first ones to struggle in a high energy tank when nutrients are low. Its not because they are slow growers. Its because they are slow eaters

If the plants in your tank was a pack of wolves, and ferts was a fresh kill, anubias and ferns would be the old or weak ones that have to wait their turn and hope there's some scraps left over. Different dynamic obviously but the important point is they just dont 'get it' as fast as the other plants. The water column needs to be extra rich to for them to do well in a "fast" tank

And again this seems backwards to me because needing so little, youd think they'd be the last plants to have issues in a tank like this when nutrients are low. But experience has shown me they are usually the first

 

[Burr740]

How are liking the spray bar? Is the velocity really strong, and/or do you think it cuts down the volume of flow very much? I only ask because those tiny factory holes can get packed up easily. Even a slight build up on the edges turns those eighth inch holes into a sixteenth. Which of course changes how much overall flow the tank is getting

Personally I like to drill the holes a little bigger, say 3/16. It will cut down on the velocity coming out but allows for the maximum volume to pass through on a more consistent basis, because they dont get packed up so easily. Im not saying you need to do this, just something to think about

Also is that a heater I see in the back left? Unless the temp dips way below 70 I would avoid a heater like the plague. The cooler the better for plants, especially in a high energy tank. Sudiorca touched on this recently in great detail. Big difference for plants in the lower 70s than the upper 70s for example. If you have fish that need high temp (I dont see any), Id get different fish

 

[Mr.Shenanagins]

I think I’d salvage the plants that are healthy at this point and restart. I know you’ve already mentioned you don’t have this issue in your other tanks, so I think maybe tossing the sub, sterilizing the tank and filter and giving it another go would be best instead of repeat aggravation with this mystery algae. I completely understand how annoying it is and time consuming to start over, I just hate that all your efforts have been ineffective.

 

[Burr740]

I wouldnt say the efforts have been ineffective. Think he's actually got it just about whooped now that the plants are doing good. It just came back on those couple of plants that still had unhealthy growth present. Im not a fan of the mts at all but it doesnt look like that was the problem. I think its on the downhill side now :knocksonwood:

 

[Unexpected]

If the plants in your tank was a pack of wolves, and ferts was a fresh kill, anubias and ferns would be the old or weak ones that have to wait their turn and hope there's some scraps left over.

This is great! This is difficult to explain to new folk to the hobby.

 

[Mr.Shenanagins]

Frank and I discussed the sub in the past and agreed that it’s contents were a bit unpredictable. But I agree I think at this point anything harmful would have leached out or dissipated by now.

Fingers crossed as well

 

[Joel Armstrong]

Im not a fan of the mts at all but it doesnt look like that was the problem

Hey Joe, what is "mts" ?

 

[Burr740]

Hey Joe, what is "mts" ?

Mineralized top soil

 

[GreggZ]

Personally I like to drill the holes a little bigger, say 3/16. It will cut down on the velocity coming out but allows for the maximum volume to pass through on a more consistent basis, because they dont get packed up so easily. Im not saying you need to do this, just something to think about

Also is that a heater I see in the back left? Unless the temp dips way below 70 I would avoid a heater like the plague. The cooler the better for plants, especially in a high energy tank. Sudiorca touched on this recently in great detail. Big difference for plants in the lower 70s than the upper 70s for example. If you have fish that need high temp (I dont see any), Id get different fish

+1 on both of these comments.

I drilled out the holes on my spray bars a long time ago. There is less velocity, which is actually a good thing. You really want a nice wide laminar flow. Some plants just don't like being in the path of a high velocity stream.

And I also stopped using heaters a long time ago. In general a tank is just easier and more manageable at lower temps.

To me the tank right now looks pretty good and I am guessing you are not far off. We've all been through things like this and hopefully once it get it solved you (and WE) can learn something from it.

 

[Mr.Shenanagins]

And I also stopped using heaters a long time ago. In general a tank is just easier and more manageable at lower temps.

I’ve done this as well, my tank sits at 70 all year. Also, what size are the holes on your spray bar?

 

[FrankZ]

How are liking the spray bar? Is the velocity really strong, and/or do you think it cuts down the volume of flow very much?

The spray bar slowed the velocity down a lot without sacrificing flow. Its the second one I tried, forget where I got it but the holes are large enough that I can get the tweezer tip inside with out issue. The fish seem a lot happier with the spray bar especially the cory cats.

Also is that a heater I see in the back left? Unless the temp dips way below 70 I would avoid a heater like the plague.

Yes it’s a heater. I have it set on a InkBird thermocouple at 70F. Reason being is my RO barrel is the basement and the temp gets down to the mid to low 60’s in the winter time. It helps get the tank warmed up a bit faster after water changes.

 

[FrankZ]

I think I’d salvage the plants that are healthy at this point and restart. I know you’ve already mentioned you don’t have this issue in your other tanks, so I think maybe tossing the sub, sterilizing the tank and filter and giving it another go would be best instead of repeat aggravation with this mystery algae. I completely understand how annoying it is and time consuming to start over, I just hate that all your efforts have been ineffective.

I think I’m the upswing with the tank. The only lingering issue was the fern. I should know by Wednesday or Thursday if the slime is going to come back anywhere else.

I’ll get a photo shortly to show the growth since Saturday.

 

[FrankZ]

Apologise if it sounds like a broken record, but if I were still not confident with the health and stability of the tank I would throw in some more fast growing plants, or floaters, until everything is settled and you feel less plant mass looks better.

That fern wall was taking a huge amount of space in the back. I cut the hygro trifold back pretty hard too when I took it out. Everything is growing back nicely.

 

[FrankZ]

Only plant growing slow now is the new crypt which is still adjusting from low tech.

 

[Mr.Shenanagins]

Did you order your spray bar from eBay or Amazon? I got mine from a guy who brands it as “Flowtamer” and he uses black furniture grade PVC